Let me just explain it like this:
Other people, ones that you've never met or likely encountered in a non-physical capacity, believe certain things. These people withhold these understandings from you. However, you're free to discover them if you simply ask the right people the right questions. Lucky for you, you're venturing down the proper path.
I'll let you in on a little secret - you not knowing how things work while others do is like sitting down to play chess with someone, only to find out that after their side of the board was stalked with the typical knights, rooks, pawns, kings, etc, but yours only has checkers.
Through this analogy, you'll just plain lose every time.
What do you do? Do you just never play Chess again, or do you go find the right pieces so you don't just lose each time you play?
Look, I know that you've been transfixed by the fear mongering of the people that hide certain knowledge from you, but should you choose to find what they harbor, you'll realize that it doesn't matter if you don't believe what other people say is real, because other people believe certain things are true even if you don't. These same people are able to do things you aren't because they have the right knowledge. So, you can sit here and complain, reach your hand out for more, begging for some slice of the pie of knowledge, or you can go out and find it for yourself, because right now, the way this stands, you sitting around asking for assurances is a waste of time.
Do you know of evidence for the existence of "esoteric forces"? What explanation/evidence can you offer?
Simply put, if you have to ask this question (which being able to ask the question is enough progress on its own), it seems like you already know the answer.
Now, if you want to ask some specific questions, I'll try to answer them. Otherwise, if we're going to sit here and pretend we're all still curious about this subject, instead of just amusing ourselves and pursuing further, I'm not sure how entertaining your imagination is really worth my time.
I know, I know, I'm a huge asshole. I should just offer you the answers to the questions you've asked instead of being cryptic, refusing to be direct and just confusing you further, but questions like this take us nowhere. The reason is simple, too: if you have to ask questions like this, how are you going to be receptive of my answers?
Skepticism isn't just welcome, it's necessary, but, with that being said, you shouldn't have any doubts about this... I've had to ask the proper questions all of the way up. I had to come to my own realizations with only minimal assistance (which I'm certainly not going to refrain from offering you or anyone else should they apply effort).
It would be unwise to just dump answers on you, mostly just because you not having a foundation built by yourself means you'll have issues with just believing anything you're told, with being lazy, and ultimately falling prey to dogmatic idiocy. I don't want this for you. I don't want it for myself.
So, it's for these reasons that I'm (implicitly, really) warned against just giving you the right answers at the wrong times.
So, in other words, it seems like you've already answered your own question, that there is indeed some escoteric forces shaping our world. Just know, finding these answers isn't always easy and in more ways than one.
I hope this is helpful. Please don't be too defensive with this, because what I've said (I think, anyway) is extremely important.
you're free to discover them if you simply ask the right people the right questions.
It really does come down to this. The problem is, who are the right people? What exactly are the right questions. This clearly requires iteration.
I'll let you in on a little secret - you not knowing how things work while others do is like sitting down to play chess with someone, only to find out that after their side of the board was stalked with the typical knights, rooks, pawns, kings, etc, but yours only has checkers.
You've just described black box model building. Also, you've just exposed a critical problem with it. The problem is no intuition, just correlation of the system. Your moves will work, but don't necessarily make any sense. When the system changes, you won't be able to compensate quickly enough.
I should just offer you the answers to the questions you've asked instead of being cryptic, refusing to be direct and just confusing you further, but questions like this take us nowhere.
Without well honed questions, he won't find well understood answers. It's good that he's taking a stab at conversing a bit though, but what you say here is important. Asking paradigm shifting questions takes a lot of work and only comes from rejecting many answers - i.e. realizing they don't fit.
So, it's for these reasons that I'm (implicitly, really) warned against just giving you the right answers at the wrong times.
What you say is very good. He won't understand the answers if you gave them here. The same words to construct the question will have two paradigms of meaning and the answers won't really jive with what his questions are. It does appear he's looking to understand though and hopefully stabs around it to gain more insight.
I responded to one of your comments above. Great discussion.
Just don't think I have all of the answers... or even half of them.
The key, as you pointed out, is to hone in on the right questions that yield answers which provide utility. The questions worth pursing are the ones that provide the utility, or virtue, or progress to some goal that an answer would provide.
I believe this is what you were touching on.
No offense taken. As for motives for asking the question, the idea was not to be dismissive or claim there is no evidence. Also I made a point to ask for "evidence that suggests" rather than "evidence that proves," since things like this tend to be hard to prove. Most people seem to just feel it -- recognize the workings of greater powers on the masses when they see it. But there should be effects we can point to that begin to build a case for the idea. If you can start to build a case then you can communicate with others... at least those who are receptive.
The foundations you're seeking lie in the explanations of classified materials (for good reason), along with the mystery schools/religions and similar secret orders. This is precisely what is "hidden" in the occult.
CERN(unnos) is making feverish attempts to conjure... well, just that. Again, this proves that it doesn't matter how badly you desire evidence because we're past the goyim/profane needing evidence here.
Should you discover what lies within, you'll not need tangible or visible evidence anymore.
This is me telling you that you're asking the right question the wrong way.
As I stated before, the banned "gnostic texts" made very specific assertions, describing that we're all one (hint hint).
Canaanites worshiped El Molech and Asheroth as "gods", but we know now that they are simply what you would call "aliens", "spirits", "demons", etc.
Without going too far in to things, you must be made aware that bodies, physical bodies, in this density are merely HOSTS for other... inspirations, we'll say.
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