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The USB standards is a mess that makes my brain melt. There are so many standards about the speed for data and charge time that you need to do a research before buying anything related to USB. For example, I bought headphones with USB recharge port. I am just lucky that my computer has the right USB, otherwise It would be impossible to recharge them. My computer has 4 USB ports, but only 1 is compatible with my headphones. I still don't know if corporations are owned by idiots, or by perverts who like to fuck with customers.

The USB standards is a mess that makes my brain melt. There are so many standards about the speed for data and charge time that you need to do a research before buying anything related to USB. For example, I bought headphones with USB recharge port. I am just lucky that my computer has the right USB, otherwise It would be impossible to recharge them. My computer has 4 USB ports, but only 1 is compatible with my headphones. I still don't know if corporations are owned by idiots, or by perverts who like to fuck with customers.

(post is archived)

[–] • 8 pts

It stopped being "universal" as soon as they released newer versions, and that is the core of their problem.

USB was meant to provide standard detection and management design patterns to improve on RS232 serial and PS/2. Those busses were focused on a narrow category of devices like mice and keyboards which use low data rates and low power.

Then designers started pushing that scope to the limits, and USB itself became a chokepoint. Competing busses started coming out and, instead of holding on to the integrity of a non-changing & working spec, the USB group decided to pervert it and compete harder. Now the scope of what USB is and isn't is defined with a blurred line.

[–] • 0 pt

"One standard connector type!"

Decades later...What. The. Shit. is going on here?!?

[–] • 0 pt

new releases should be backwards compatible if they follow the standard.

[–] • 0 pt

yep but they aren't

thank china

[–] • 0 pt

Most of the time ( in my experience) the data follows the standard. They use the same chip(s) for just about every electronic device with USB. now the mechanics of it is a whole different story. They all want to make their own connector and sell it at a premium price. and although they use the same standard on the traffic, the interpreting software may be custom and of no standard. if it requires a special driver for the operating system it is attached to, it should be provided with the system. I know most prolific adapters come with their own disc and will not work if you don't install the driver. but once installed, It usually works as advertised. I go all the way back to the TRS80, commodore 64, vic 20 era. not pulling rank , but I've seen it all. :-)

[–] • 0 pt

Eh, universal just meant that you could plug in all different kinds of peripherals, which is still true. It used to be that most different kinds of peripherals had their own port (although several ports were overloaded on functionality, and many custom/odd peripherals reused the ports designed for other things).

Versioning of buses is hardly unique to USB. Technology must advance. People want to plug their shit in arbitrarily, have it work, AND have it be fast.

The problem is with imprecise labeling of what ports are capable of and what devices require. This is the fault of manufacturers of laptops and shitty widgets, who, frankly DNGAF. I also note that, with respect to the DisplayPort alternate debacle, it's not a single group of people defining what works. It's a hodgepodge of groups trying to reuse the same port.

[–] • 0 pt

universal just meant that you could plug in all different kinds of peripherals, which is still true

No, that's the blurred line now. If "plug in" means strictly physical, sure. If you mean to operate at a minimal mode of compatibility between mixed versions, okay. But when a device behaves differently depending on what version the host is running, and depending on whether the hub is powered or not, then it's not exactly "universal" anymore...at least not the way I define universal.

Versioning of buses is hardly unique to USB. Technology must advance.

It's marketed as "the same as before, just better". For use cases that are that much more demanding of power, bandwidth, scalability, accessibility, reliability, or anything that just needs more complexity, they shouldn't use USB for that. Use the right tool for the right job, as they say, and USB is not a one size fits all bus.

[–] • 0 pt

I will give you that "Universal" for the foreseeable future is going to be a lie.

USB has always been more about cheap than good. And yet "good enough" means that not a lot of devices embrace alternatives.

[–] [deleted] • 3 pts

What said, USB has gone from Universal Serial Bus to Uber Shit Bus.

Not sure what your exact issue is, but if it's power related (your usb ports don't provide "enough power"), you could look into buying a powered usb hub. They have a plug for an outlet so your computer does not have to provide the power itself.

[–] • 2 pts

USB is clear about how much power it provides (IIRC 5W shared among all peripherals as of USB 2.0). The problem is that people design devices that pull much more than that and take advantage of the fact that a lot of controllers let them get away with it.

[–] • 1 pt

It is done on purpose, so you have one more reason to change your device

When you look at reality try to think: Who is going to gain (financially/power) from this choice ?

Big surprises await you

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

What really gets me is that a lot of newer devices won't work with USB hubs. Webcams, docks, etc.

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

I still don't know if corporations are owned by idiots, or by perverts who like to fuck with customers.

Both.

[–] • 1 pt (edited )

Nearly everything would have been usable with a Type-A plug. I do not want something designed to be a poxy 1mm thinner if it means I now have to use a special connector. nothing has ever required a Micro-B plug, and Kindles seem to be the only device that chose to use it

Apple not adding USB to iPads is so annoying, moving photos off Apple kit is a PITA

[–] • 1 pt

The standard is still universal, The hardware and current exceeds the standard. you plug any device into a usb socket and assuming it doesn't over current the receptacle and the hardware actually fits; it will work. The standard limited the current to 1/2 amp (500 milliamps), designers created devices that can pull up to a couple amps. It's not the fault of the standard or the connector that doesn't fit is the fault of the standard. It's the fault of the developer exceeding the standard to nuance the hardware to do what the standard wasn't capable of. It still beats the hell out of rs232. They don't get a premium price and aren't competitive if they offer what everyone else offers.

[–] • 0 pt

One of the biggest ironies of the U in USB standing for universal. Fucking annoying to keep track and vet everything just to ensure compatibility

[–] • 0 pt

One side is universal, so you need all these adapter cords for the other side.

[–] • 0 pt

Better dealing with this than go through serial port complete (jan axelson). Dont get me wrong, great book but thats heartache for comm

[–] • 0 pt

Yeah, the new USB-C standard creates a load of potential issues. As people get addicted to the new speed, they will demand more C ports. If manufacturers oblige, then decades of USB 3/2/1 devices will be rendered obsolete.

Most new motherboards have already dropped the PS/2 port, which is a shame. Unlike USB 3, the PS/2 protocol is not dependent on the CPU chipset. At the rate the tech is advancing, a few years from now, the USB 3/2 protocol will be called a "Legacy" port, just as PS/2 has been for the last decade.

[–] • 2 pts

USB-C ports are largely compatible with old device -- you just need an adapter which is easy to understand. Frankly, you're lucky you can plug in something made 10 years ago and have it work at all.

Also, what are you trying to say about PS/2 being independent of the CPU chipset in a way that USB is not? PS/2 has a lot of properties that make it suck. For one, it's ill-defined and ill-prepared to accept things like mice with extra buttons and custom refresh/DPI rates. For two, it does not officially support hotplugging. Imagine telling a millennial they have to reboot their computer in order to plug in the mouse.

[–] • 0 pt

Good thing I am a Millenial who knows that a PS/2 device needs to be plugged in before the computer boots.

Are you saying that mice with extra buttons did not exist during the PS/2 standard? Because PS/2 was still the standard back during the 2000s, when my family bought our first desktop computer. And while PC gaming was not mainstream during that decade, popular games like Doom and Wolfenstein came out during the early 90s.

As for the motherboard and CPU thing, it was something I learned because, back in 2020, I totally wanted to install Windows 7 on a Ryzen board. That was when I learned that the USB 3 protocol is controlled by the CPU chipset, and eventually, as the USB standard continues to evolve, Windows 7 will be left behind completely in the USB 2 era. Anyway, the motherboard I bought has a PS/2 port, and I had to buy and use a PS/2 mouse to complete the Windows 7 installation.

Another thing I learned, is that newer CPU chipsets, actually now "see" all USB ports as 3.x ports, even 2.0 ports. So, basically, even the USB 2.0 ports need USB 3.0 drivers now. Back then, it was still possible to find and install drivers that were compatible with the chipset, but it was kind of like a game of roulette, in that out of the total number of 3.x ports, some of them would not work. So, as time goes by, it will likely become impossible to install chipset drivers that work with Windows 7, even if a newer motherboard has a PS/2 port.

[–] • 0 pt

Are you saying that mice with extra buttons did not exist during the PS/2 standard?

The whole standard is ill defined. There's room in the protocol for random buttons. USB allows for more descriptive information between the hardware and host during negotiation. Thins like the mouse communicating the DPI and desired refresh rate are not supported at all in PS/2.

What the OS "sees" is dependent on the kind of controller. The USB 3.0 controller needs different drivers than 2.0. Motherboards ship/shipped with a mix of 2.0 and 3.0 controllers, which I thought was to save cost, but I suppose it also has the side effect of backwards compatibility.

[–] • 0 pt

I hate USB, it's handy but I hate it, fuckers made it so you have to look at the port to avoid inserting it updside down, it's fucking retarded it's like if you had a right and wrong way to insert jacks, fucking retarded idea

[–] • 1 pt

Yea it seems like 9 out of 10 times I find myself having to turn it upside down. Why could they have designed it to plug in either way?

[–] • 0 pt

"So we'll make a correct way to insert it... And a wrong way..." bunch of faggots

[–] • 0 pt

Up until lightning and USB C all ports had a right and wrong way.