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She's very confusing at times, and it makes no sense. It's gotten so cryptic at times, ive decided to wait it out and see how she reacts next month. Sometimes she's very adamant she wants to get married, and then other times she says she wants to wait a year. Yet other times she wants to get married today, and then other times she feels like she doubts whether she wants to get married as a concept vs not getting married. I've had a lot of conflicting answers where at this point, i have no clue what im supposed to make out of it.

I know that a lot of the issues is because her parents and siblings feed her mind poison which causes a lot of conflicting views to be presented at the same time, but at the same time, this woman cant live off only what her parents say. She's even mentioned as such that she hates it, but now it's still very confusing. I don't want to ask the parents during the December season since the holidays are coming up, so i was thinking asking towards January or February instead

She's very confusing at times, and it makes no sense. It's gotten so cryptic at times, ive decided to wait it out and see how she reacts next month. Sometimes she's very adamant she wants to get married, and then other times she says she wants to wait a year. Yet other times she wants to get married today, and then other times she feels like she doubts whether she wants to get married as a concept vs not getting married. I've had a lot of conflicting answers where at this point, i have no clue what im supposed to make out of it. I know that a lot of the issues is because her parents and siblings feed her mind poison which causes a lot of conflicting views to be presented at the same time, but at the same time, this woman cant live off only what her parents say. She's even mentioned as such that she hates it, but now it's still very confusing. I don't want to ask the parents during the December season since the holidays are coming up, so i was thinking asking towards January or February instead

(post is archived)

[–] • 4 pts (edited )

It's hard to say for sure from only knowing you and the situation from those 2 paragraphs, but my guess is that primarily 2 things are going on here:

  1. Women are genetically wired to defer to the guy. Therefore an non-ignorable part of herself wants you to make the decision and she'll just go along with it.

  2. Women have been so fucked up by feminism and all the other BS that's taught them to be strong and independent that she also wants/needs to be 100% in charge and in control.

The conflict between these 2 factors is, in effect, making her nuts. And you're along for the ride.

What's the solution? Well for her I have no idea because I don't know her. For you I think you have to decide whether you are prepared to continue to play a passive role and go along with whatever she eventually 'decides' to do, and when. Or instead do you take control of the situation and either 1. bail, or 2. try to set her straight. Setting her straight would be the best for everyone -- ie. her, you, and society at large -- but it's not your job to fix crazy. Is she crazy or is she just a little confused? Your call, man.

Good luck. You're gonna need it.

[–] • 1 pt

That woman needs someone to be in charge of her is my takeaway.

[–] • 1 pt (edited )

A lot of women have a hard time deciding anything at all. To some extent I think it's normal for women (though not a good thing), but at the least you want a woman who, when she does make a decision, sticks with it.

What concerns me here is that she sounds to be incapable of making any sort of strong decision and sticking with it. Add to that the fact that whatever decision(s) she might make are largely driven by OTHER people, who may or may not offer good advice to begin with. You actually said that what they have to offer is "poison"... so, that's not very reassuring.

She seems fickle. Her mind changes daily regarding her feelings on marriage (I'll go out on a limb and presume on other important things, as well).. So your thought process is what exactly? That if you marry her, she'll magically stop being fickle? Shit doesn't work that way, dude.

Dude, what happens if you catch her on a good day, get married, then she decides she doesn't want to be married? Because that's pretty much what I would expect based on the information you've presented here.

The first time I got married, my woman at the time was CERTAIN she wanted to be married. She never waivered on that. She was ready to be married before I was, and I was pretty much pressured into getting married before I was ready. And even then, she was fickle on pretty much everything else in her life.

Like your girlfriend (I'm presuming), my ex-wife couldn't make the simplest of decisions without convening a panel of people to discuss the options. And most of the time, that panel of people was made up of utter fucking morons.. with the exception of two people: myself and her father. But even then, it demonstrated a lack of common sense decision making, confidence, and ability to parse between good or bad advice. My ex-wife was an over-educated idiot, in short. She had a master's degree, but ZERO.. I mean, ZERO common sense.

I'm not saying that it's bad to get wise counsel for big decisions where you're really not sure what to do.. but FFS, some things you should just "know" what to do based on common sense and/or some set of moral standards.

Again, I'm only going off of what you've presented here, but my spidey-senses are going off hard AF reading about your girlfriend..people who are that easily influenced are also easily manipulated.

The logical conclusion is that you wouldn't really be married to and dealing with her, but married to and dealing with EVERYONE IN HER FAMILY who "poisons" her mind on a daily basis (your words, not mine).

It sounds like she has no sense of self identity and I'll go out on a limb and assume (correct me if I'm wrong) that she also is bad at keeping her own boundaries and respecting others' boundaries. If she also has boundary issues, that should be a HUGE fucking red flag. People don't tend to think about boundaries, but let me tell you that they are important AF and can make or break a marriage.

For example, if the two of you have an issue/disagreement between the both of you, what happens? Do you work it out amongst yourselves and only bring in outsiders when it's necessary and agreed upon by the both of you? Or is her first reaction to start asking friends/family their opinions regarding an issue between you and her? This is something I dealt with in my marriage constantly. My ex-wife had ZERO fucking boundaries...and that shit can eventually end up manifesting in other awful ways.. for instance, adultery. Think about it. Adultery in of itself is an act based on having a lack of boundaries, is it not? And DO NOT BELIEVE that if a woman claims to be a "Christian" that adultery is something she isn't capable of. If she doesn't have a healthy set of boundaries for herself and others, then she is capable of doing literally ANYTHING you can imagine. Fucking trust me on this.

You need to switch off the emotions and look at this situation logically.

I'm about to get married for the second time in 4 months from now. This time, however, I made damn sure what I was getting into beforehand. I tested for boundary issues, I tested for fickleness. I tested for maturity, common sense, the ability to make decisions. If the fiancee and I have an issue, we deal with it between the two of us. And not simply because I prefer that and she's placating me, but also because SHE prefers the same by default. This woman has boundaries. Her mom is a nice woman, but also tends to overstep boundaries if given the opportunity. My fiancee will shut that woman the fuck down if she steps out of line. My fiancee has BOUNDARIES, in other words, and is not shy about enforcing them. Thus, she is protective of our relationship. She also has common sense. She also has a set of morals, she doesn't just say that she does for the sake of appearances. I can't tell you how refreshing it is to be with this woman VS the vicious hellscape from which I came in my previous marriage. It's literally a night VS day difference.

Contrast that against my first time around in marriage, where I just sort of said "well I like her so let's see what happens". And I saw what happened. And it was awful. Divorce is awful. People don't realize how awful it is. Granted, I'm glad not to be married to such an awful excuse for a human being now in hindsight.. but it would have been better had I never married her in the first place. I IGNORED MY GUT. My gut said at the least "no, stick this relationship out longer to see if it actually has legs before getting married". It said "something isn't right about this bitch." And instead, I treated my own life like a fucking blackjack hand at a $5 table in Reno. DO NOT do what I did.

You better be damn sure of what you're getting into before you take it to the level of marriage, my man. And you better not ignore or gloss over red flags. Your entire post is basically you saying "Here are some red flags, what should I do?"

And then by the end of the post, the only thing you seem to be questioning is when to pop the question. C'mon man. Be smart about this. Your future self will thank you.

I'm not telling you what to do here. I'm just saying that if I'm correct about your GF and her family (which I may not be), then you better be smart about this. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. A stupid man (which is what I was) has to make the mistakes himself before learning anything.

[–] [deleted] • 0 pt

To explain the mind poison part, ill give some examples I witnessed. Every time she would ask clarification questions in the beginning of the relationship, the model used was a relay between me and her mom. She would act as the mediator between the two, with her siblings injected into the middle. The thing is, yes, my past actions have very valid reasons and explanations, however, they come off as weird to someone who doesn't come from such an environment. So one sibling was trying to make it seem like im an axe wielding psycho, one was saying that my gf should just ghost me/treat me like shit, and than there was the take it slow advice. The thing is all the advice given went contrary to what my gf wanted, so you end up in a very nasty position where you end up being some sort of antidote between the person you're with and the vitriol coming from the parents.

The marriage case has been really weird because im not used to the conventions of the why in this family. The reactions im getting from my gf about asking her parents have been so wild as to be from horribly baffling to very easy going. From my position without an accurate gauge on their reaction, i could be walking into a massive trap and not even realize it, or causing a lot of resentment within the family for even asking.

[–] • 0 pt (edited )

Dude….this relationship could possibly be doable if she had boundaries and was willing to enforce them regardless of the blowback from her family. And even then, she would still likely have issues to get worked out so that she could remain healthy in such a batshit insane family environment.

But I don’t get the impression that she has any boundaries at all. I mentioned this in my original post as a speculation, but you’ve pretty much confirmed that I was correct with your reply.

The only two people in charge of a relationship should be the two people in the relationship. That’s not the case here.

If you marry this woman, every decision, disagreement…EVERYTHING will be dealt with and decided by this dysfunctional group of clowns.

This means that when it comes to your marriage, instead of two people getting a vote (as it should be), multiple people get a vote. So, your own vote as it pertains to YOUR relationship will be negated and/or discounted by other people who you aren’t married to and shouldn’t even get a vote.

It would be like if Californians, New Yorkers, and Oregonians were allowed to vote in our state government elections here in Texas. They don’t actually live here and I do, but yet they get a vote?

Run, dude. Run and don’t look back.

If you marry this woman it’s clearly out of your own desperation (fear of loneliness or sex withdrawls?)

There are millions of women. You can find a good one. This ain’t it.

Preferably, you want someone who comes from a healthy family dynamic.

At the least, the woman needs to already be aware of whether or not she was brought up in a functional or dysfunctional family…she should know this without you having to tell her..and if it’s dysfunctional and she is aware that it is, then she must already understand and have boundaries to guard against the crazies in her own family, and be willing to consistently enforce those boundaries. She should already be practiced at this before you are dating her.

My fiancée did not come from a healthy family dynamic. BUT, she is aware of it and already knows what she must do in terms of boundaries and such. And she does it. I didn’t have to bring these things up with her or make her aware of them. She already knew. That is key. My ex-wife became begrudgingly aware because that awareness was foisted upon her by external forces (namely me). But even then, because she didn’t come to that knowledge of her own volition, there was never a real commitment to dealing with it on her part. Her life, to this day, is still completely run by a combination of unreliable, fleeting emotions coupled with the opinions of immoral idiots just like herself. If she gets married again, it will be her third marriage. THIRD. No one gets married THREE times without having a hand in all the failure along the way.

One big difference between my ex-wife and myself is that I actually own up to my own mistakes and learned from them. She never has, and sadly, she probably never will. Every failed relationship in her life is 100% “the other person’s fault”, just ask her LOL.

But I digress. Don’t marry a fickle, crazy, easily-influenced dumbass with a family full of clowns. Just don’t.

I know this isn’t what you want to hear, but this shit seems very crystal clear to me. It’s like I’m watching someone going down the same road I’ve already been down in slow motion and I’m screaming “don’t do it!”

[–] • 1 pt

how old are you both?

[–] • 1 pt

Girls don’t know what they want. A lot of them are anxious creatures filled with doubt. If you want to spend the rest of your life with her, and want to end the back-and-forth, just propose

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

I can confirm the anxiety, however i tend to redirect the anxiety and shield her from some of the bigger issues. The problem is since her life is run as a trial by committee, what was once seen as a good idea, is viscerally denied the next day. And this is how you end up with very conflicting, all over the place ideas, which become impossible to keep up with

[–] • 1 pt

You could just get engaged and hold off marriage plans. Engagement is meant for a couple to continue getting to know each other. Breaking off an engagement is better than divorce.

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

True, i had to explain this to my gf too, the difference between being engaged vs being married. As it turns out, no one ever explained to her how dating for marriage works ... and i would think this was done by design by the family to keep her locked into their ways. However, seeing as i dont swallow bullshit flat, i can see her family for what they are, manipulative, petty, backstabbing assholes. How do i know this? Because her family draws a lot of dynamic similarities to my own, except to a much lesser severity. However, part of fixing the problem is acknowledging the problem exists, and whilst she does talk about the problem being there, she refuses to acknowledge her family could be intentionally sabotaging her own life for personal gain.

In terms of salvage, this relationship is completely redeemable on the condition she pretty much is far far, FAR away from her parents and siblings. Deprogramming requires distance, and the problem right now is she isn't even capable of compromising with her family, to the point she always caves in to their demands. She knows they are wrong, and does it anyways, making her complicit in the abuse. Heck I have a safe house out in the middle of nowhere we could head of to, and i mentioned as such, so i have been preparing her on the idea.

[–] • 1 pt

Women are wishy-washy. That's not the problem. The real problem here is the part about the family feeding her mind poison. You not only have to be firm with her about what you two are Going to do, you also have to deal with her family. For the most part, when you get married you marry the whole family! They are not going to magically disappear or stop feeding her shit just because you got married. My stupid father-in-law thought he would be brilliant and start sharpening his knife when I came over courting. When he got done with his knife I whipped out mine and borrowed his sharpening stone! LOL. When her mom started bitching at me I would just laugh at her and say something like, "bless your heart". LOLOL!!! But then I would just go on about my business like she didn't even matter. Her sisters were the Worst! She has one that will still try, every so often but, to drive a wedge between us. It took many years of putting up with their crap before she finally came around and settled down. In that time all the craziness definitely had negative effects on our children! In my case it was Not worth it! If I had to do it over again, knowing what I know now, it would be a Hard Pass! I have one child that is a total loss! I don't believe that one will Ever be okay! It Can be done. But it may come at a very high price! Good Luck!

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

For the most part, when you get married you marry the whole family!

Not in my case, my family is dead to me after all the crap they tried pulling on me. I dont even get so much as a phone call anymore from anyone on my side except maybe one of my siblings.

Her sisters were the Worst! She has one that will still try, every so often but, to drive a wedge between us.

Exact problem im dealing with, her sister is both single and somewhat older, and keeps feeding her volcel type crap you'd find on 4chan. This has caused a lot of issues, as she would rather listen to her family than what she wants, leading to some very annoying situations and problems.

It Can be done. But it may come at a very high price!

Sure it can, it just depends how much i want to put up with. In this case, i think a healthy amount of distance for her would be a good thing, but it could also lead to a heavy amount of resentment from being taken away from the viper's den

[–] [deleted] • 0 pt

She wants a gigantic expensive wedding but she feels bad about spending so much money.

[–] • 0 pt

Any time she is saying that she doesn't want to get married, or she doesn't know if she wants to get married, she is doing the same thing when she wants a compliment and says she looks bad in some way. She wants you to simp and tell her things like you want to get married to her etc.

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